55 episodes

Get ready for a deep dive into what cybersecurity professionals often refer to as the "8th Layer" of security: HUMANS. Welcome to 8th Layer Insights (8Li). This podcast is a multidisciplinary exploration into how the complexities of human nature affect security and risk. Author, security researcher, and behavior science enthusiast Perry Carpenter taps experts for their insights and illumination. Topics include cybersecurity, psychology, behavior science, communication, leadership, and more.

8th Layer Insights Perry Carpenter | N2K Networks

    • Technology
    • 5.0 • 54 Ratings

Get ready for a deep dive into what cybersecurity professionals often refer to as the "8th Layer" of security: HUMANS. Welcome to 8th Layer Insights (8Li). This podcast is a multidisciplinary exploration into how the complexities of human nature affect security and risk. Author, security researcher, and behavior science enthusiast Perry Carpenter taps experts for their insights and illumination. Topics include cybersecurity, psychology, behavior science, communication, leadership, and more.

    How AI Can Deceive and be Deceived

    How AI Can Deceive and be Deceived

    On this episode Perry sits down with Dr. Matthew Canham to explore ways in which AI can be weaponized against us, and how age old social engineering tactics can be used to trick large language models.

    Guest:
    Dr. Matthew Canham (LinkedIn) (Website)
    Books and References (Books are Amazon Associate Links and help support the show):

    Cognitive Security Institute YouTube Channel

    Cognitive Security Institute website

    YouTube video: BlackHat Presentation -- Me and My Evil Digital Twin: The Psychology of Human Exploitation by AI Assistants

    YouTube video: NEW AI Jailbreak Method SHATTERS GPT4, Claude, Gemini, LLaMA


    Not with a Bug, But with a Sticker: Attacks on Machine Learning Systems and What To Do About Them, by Ram Shankar Siva Kumar & Hyrum Anderson


    Six Thinking Hats, the de Bono Group


    Six Thinking Hats: Looking at Decision in Different Ways, MindTools


    AI + Six Thinking Hats, LifeArchitect.ai

    8Li Season 4, episode 10: Artificial Intelligence Insights & Oddities


    Perry's Books (Amazon Associate Links)


    Transformational Security Awareness: What Neuroscientists, Storytellers, and Marketers Can Teach Us About Driving Secure Behaviors, by Perry Carpenter


    The Security Culture Playbook: An Executive Guide To Reducing Risk and Developing Your Human Defense Layer by Perry Carpenter & Kai Roer


    Production Credits:
    Music and Sound Effects by Blue Dot Sessions, Envato Elements, & Storyblocks.
    Artwork by Chris Machowski @ https://www.RansomWear.net/ and Mia Rune @ https://www.MiaRune.com.
    8th Layer Insights theme music composed and performed by Marcos Moscat @ https://www.GameMusicTown.com/
    Want to get in touch with Perry? Here's how:

    LinkedIn

    Twitter

    Instagram

    Email: perry [at] 8thLayerMedia [dot] com

    • 54 min
    Frame the Future: The Art of Becoming a Futurist

    Frame the Future: The Art of Becoming a Futurist

    On this episode Perry sits down with Jeremy Treadwell, a people-first technologist and futurist, to get the lowdown on how a futurist approaches the world.

    Guest:
    Jeremy Treadwell (LinkedIn) (Twitter)

    Books and References (Books are Amazon Associate Links and help support the show):

    YouTube Video: What UX/UI Taught Me about Improving Security Awareness [SANS Security Awareness Summit 2022], Jeremy Treadwell

    YouTube Video: Reimagine the Future of Data, Privacy + Security with Technologist Jeremy Treadwell


    The Institute for the Future website


    Four Questions to Turn Everyone in Your Company Into a Futurist, FastCompany article


    How Does a Futurist See the Future, LinkedIn Article by Jacob Morgan


    The Black Swan: Second Edition: The Impact of the Highly Improbable: With a new section: "On Robustness and Fragility", by Nassim Nicholas Taleb


    The Gray Rhino: How to Recognize and Act on the Obvious Dangers We Ignore, by Michele Wucker


    William Gibson’s Future Is Now, Pagan Kennedy, the New York Times

    8Li Season 1, episode 8: The Risk Episode: Black Swans, Grey Rhinos, Angels & Demons


    Perry's Books (Amazon Associate Links)


    Transformational Security Awareness: What Neuroscientists, Storytellers, and Marketers Can Teach Us About Driving Secure Behaviors, by Perry Carpenter


    The Security Culture Playbook: An Executive Guide To Reducing Risk and Developing Your Human Defense Layer by Perry Carpenter & Kai Roer


    Production Credits:
    Music and Sound Effects by Blue Dot Sessions, Envato Elements, & Storyblocks.
    Artwork by Chris Machowski @ https://www.RansomWear.net/ and Mia Rune @ https://www.MiaRune.com.
    8th Layer Insights theme music composed and performed by Marcos Moscat @ https://www.GameMusicTown.com/
    Want to get in touch with Perry? Here's how:

    LinkedIn

    Twitter

    Instagram

    Email: perry [at] 8thLayerMedia [dot] com

    • 39 min
    How to Scam a Romance Scammer

    How to Scam a Romance Scammer

    Welcome to season 5 of 8th Layer Insights!
    To celebrate Valentine's Day, Perry sits down with Emmy winning reporter Kerry Tomlinson to talk about the time she turned the tables on a romance scammer.

    Guest:
    Kerry Tomlinson (LinkedIn) (Website) (YouTube)

    Books and References:

    YouTube video: Inside a romance scam: how to make a catfisher sing


    YouTube video: Scammers are stealing people's faces for live video calls


    National Cybersecurity Alliance : Online Romance and Dating Scams


    National Cybersecurity Alliance : Romance Scams Resource Kit


    Federal Trade Commission: Romance scammers’ favorite lies exposed


    Know Your Meme: On the Internet, Nobody Knows You're A Dog


    ‘NOBODY KNOWS YOU’RE A DOG’: As iconic Internet cartoon turns 20, creator Peter Steiner knows the joke rings as relevant as ever

    Wikipedia: On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog



    Perry's Books (Amazon Associate Links)


    Transformational Security Awareness: What Neuroscientists, Storytellers, and Marketers Can Teach Us About Driving Secure Behaviors, by Perry Carpenter


    The Security Culture Playbook: An Executive Guide To Reducing Risk and Developing Your Human Defense Layer by Perry Carpenter & Kai Roer


    Production Credits:
    Music and Sound Effects by Blue Dot Sessions, Envato Elements, & Storyblocks.
    Artwork by Chris Machowski @ https://www.RansomWear.net/ and Mia Rune @ https://www.MiaRune.com.
    8th Layer Insights theme music composed and performed by Marcos Moscat @ https://www.GameMusicTown.com/
    Want to get in touch with Perry? Here's how:

    LinkedIn

    Twitter

    Instagram

    Email: perry [at] 8thLayerMedia [dot] com

    • 55 min
    Artificial Intelligence: Insights & Oddities

    Artificial Intelligence: Insights & Oddities

    On this episode, Perry celebrates the one year birthday of ChatGPT by taking a look at AI from technological, philosophical, and folkloric perspectives. We see how AI was formed based on human words and works, and how it can now shape the future of human legend and belief.
    Guests:



    Brandon Karpf, Vice President at N2K Networks (LinkedIn) (Website)



    Dr. Lynne S. McNeill, Associate Professor at Utah State University (LinkedIn) (Twitter)



    Dr. John Laudun, Professor at University of Louisiana at Lafayette (LinkedIn) (Twitter) (Website)



    Lev Gorelov, Research Director at Handshake Consulting (LinkedIn) (Twitter) (Website)



    Resources






    Interview with the AI, part one, by the Brandon Karpf / the CyberWire






    'Hard Fork': An Interview With Sam Altman, by The New York Times






    The Exciting, Perilous Journey Toward AGI, Ilya Sutskever TED Talk






    Ilya: the AI scientist shaping the world, by The Guardian






    Meet Loab, the AI Art Woman Haunting the Internet: Is she a demon? A Cryptid? Or nothing at all..., the Guardian






    In 2016, Microsoft’s Racist Chatbot Revealed the Dangers of Online Conversation The bot learned language from people on Twitter—but it also learned values, IEEE Spectrum



    Perry's Digital Folklore episode about AI






    Handshake's Generative AI Masterclass on Maven




    Perry's Books (Amazon Associate links)






    Transformational Security Awareness: What Neuroscientists, Storytellers, and Marketers Can Teach Us About Driving Secure Behaviors, by Perry Carpenter






    The Security Culture Playbook: An Executive Guide To Reducing Risk and Developing Your Human Defense Layer by Perry Carpenter & Kai Roer




    Be sure to check out Perry's other show, Digital Folklore. It's all about the oddities and importance of online culture. Head over to the show's website (https://digitalfolklore.fm/) to see our custom artwork, subscribe to the newsletter, shop for merch, support the show on Patreon, and more. Want to check out what others are saying? Here's some recent press about the show: https://digitalfolklore.fm/in-the-news.
    Production Credits:
    Music and Sound Effects by Blue Dot Sessions, Envato Elements, Storyblocks, & EpidemicSound.
    8Li cover art by Chris Machowski @ https://www.RansomWear.net/.
    8th Layer Insights theme music composed and performed by Marcos Moscat @ https://www.GameMusicTown.com/
    Want to get in touch with Perry? Here's how:



    LinkedIn



    Twitter



    Instagram



    Email: perry [at] 8thLayerMedia [dot] com

    • 1 hr 5 min
    Technology and the Law of Unintended Consequences (Encore)

    Technology and the Law of Unintended Consequences (Encore)

    Let's face it. Most of us have a love/hate relationship with technology and technological advances. We dream about the new thing... but when it arrives, we are usually a little disappointed. Many of us also lament the constant erosion of privacy, the changes in social norms, and more. And, little-by-little, we allow those aspects of new technology to make us numb. We accept the cognitive dissonance of not totally being happy with the trade-offs; yet we still make the trade.
    In this episode, we explore a few of the positives and some of the unintended consequences associated with recent technological advancements. We'll hear from Dr. Lydia, Kostopoulos, Dr. Charles Chaffin, Andra Zaharia, and Aaron Barr.
    Guests:

    Dr. Lydia Kostopoulos (LinkedIn) (Website)

    Dr. Charles Chaffin (LinkedIn) (Website)

    Andra Zaharia (LinkedIn) (Website)

    Aaron Barr (LinkedIn) (Website)

    Books and Resources:

    IEEE Article: Decoupling Human Characteristics from Algorithmic Capabilities by Dr. Lydia Kostopoulos


    Numb: How the Information Age Dulls Our Senses and How We Can Get them Back by Dr. Charles Chaffin (Amazon Associate Links)


    The Numb Podcast by Dr. Charles Chaffin


    The Cyber Empathy Podcast by Andra Zaharia

    Reminder: Your 'smart AI' often involves a low-paid contractor surveilling you

    How creepy is your smart speaker?

    Newton's Laws of Motion

    Unintended Consequences

    Elon Musk's warning regarding AI


    Transformational Security Awareness: What Neuroscientists, Storytellers, and Marketers Can Teach Us About Driving Secure Behaviors, by Perry Carpenter (Amazon Associate Link)


    Everything is Alive podcast by PRX and Radiotopia


    Production Credits:
    Additional voice talent provided by Kristina Leigh.
    Additional research by Nyla Gennaoui.
    Music and Sound Effects by Blue Dot Sessions, Envato Elements, & Storyblocks.
    Artwork by Chris Machowski @ https://www.RansomWear.net/ and Mia Rune @ https://www.MiaRune.com.
    8th Layer Insights theme music composed and performed by Marcos Moscat @ https://www.GameMusicTown.com/
    Want to get in touch with Perry? Here's how:

    LinkedIn

    Twitter

    Instagram


    Email: hello [at] 8thLayerMedia [dot] com

    • 51 min
    Cybersecurity First Principles w/Rick Howard

    Cybersecurity First Principles w/Rick Howard

    On today's show, Perry sits down with Rick Howard to discuss Rick's new book and the concept of "First Principles" as they apply in the domain of cybersecurity.
    Rick Howard is the CSO of N2K and the Chief Analyst, and Senior Fellow at the N2K Cyber, formerly CyberWire. His past lives include CSO at Palo Alto Networks, CISO at TASC, the GM at Verisign/iDefense, the Counterpane SOC Director, and the Commander of the Army's Computer Emergency Response Team (CERT). Rick served 25 years in the Army, taught computer science at West Point, and recently published , "Cybersecurity First Principles: A Reboot of Strategy and Tactics."

    Guest: Rick Howard (LinkedIn)

    Rick's book, podcasts, and other stuff


    Cybersecurity First Principles: A Reboot of Strategy and Tactics (Amazon Associate link)

    Promo video for Rick's Cybersecurity First Principles video course

    CSO Perspectives Podcast

    Word Notes


    Perry's Books (Amazon Associate links)


    Transformational Security Awareness: What Neuroscientists, Storytellers, and Marketers Can Teach Us About Driving Secure Behaviors, by Perry Carpenter


    The Security Culture Playbook: An Executive Guide To Reducing Risk and Developing Your Human Defense Layer by Perry Carpenter & Kai Roer


    Be sure to check out Perry's other show, Digital Folklore. It's all about the oddities and importance of online culture. Head over to the show's website (https://digitalfolklore.fm/) to see our custom artwork, subscribe to the newsletter, shop for merch, support the show on Patreon, and more. Want to check out what others are saying? Here's some recent press about the show: https://digitalfolklore.fm/in-the-news.
    Production Credits:
    Music and Sound Effects by Blue Dot Sessions, Envato Elements, Storyblocks, & EpidemicSound.
    8Li cover art by Chris Machowski @ https://www.RansomWear.net/.
    8th Layer Insights theme music composed and performed by Marcos Moscat @ https://www.GameMusicTown.com/
    Want to get in touch with Perry? Here's how:

    LinkedIn

    Twitter

    Instagram

    Email: perry [at] 8thLayerMedia [dot] com

    • 40 min

Customer Reviews

5.0 out of 5
54 Ratings

54 Ratings

RobDircks ,

Excellent! (From an interviewee)

I got to work with Perry on the “Creativity for Non-Creatives” episode, and I was struck with how insightful his questions are, how curious he is, and how much care he puts into the process. In addition, he’s got a great presence and top-notch production values.

JRMScooter ,

Informative, Educational & Inspirational

Perry Carpenter does it again! The author of two awesome books (they’re on Amazon) he provides incredible insights in security culture, human behaviors and what it takes to secure your organization and personal lives! This is worth an hour of your time whenever it is released! You won’t be disappointed! That and his sound guy Carl is a good source of laughs!!

Santa Claus - North Pole ,

Informative and engaging

8th Layer Insights is a genuinely engaging, entertaining, and insightful podcast. I share episodes from time to time with my non-cyber security interested friends simply because of the sheer amount of quality information that Perry Carpenter provides. This is an invaluable podcast to anyone who is pursuing creating a ‘culture’ in work, is in the education field, and even more for those in the ‘security awareness’ community.

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