In this episode, Austin chats with Connor O'Hara (Celestia) about the scope of DA projects like Celestia. After a reflective discussion on a wide range of topics from the early days of Bitcoin to tradeoffs of proof-of-stake networks, Connor gets at the heart of how data availability works, how it differs from settlement and state, and where data availability and verifiability intersect. He also addresses questions around the long-term vision for the DA layer, what attacks on the DA layer may look like, tradeoffs of enshrining apps in the L1, and much more.