Summary In this episode, Andy interviews Jim Kouzes about the Seventh Edition of the classic book The Leadership Challenge (7th Edition): How to Make Extraordinary Things Happen in Organizations. They discuss the fundamentals of leadership, the impact of the global pandemic on leadership, leading across generations, and more. Jim shares practical insights and emphasizes the importance of deliberate practice in leadership development. It's an insightful conversation about timeless leadership principles with one of the most respected voices in the leadership field over the decades. Sound Bites "Leadership is a relationship and listening is fundamental to building a positive relationship." (Regarding diversity and inclusion) "Let's assume for a moment, you have the right mix of people. That doesn't mean that any of those people feel included and feel valued. The key word is feel...." "I've often thought about leadership as a profession. If you're doing something eight hours a day or more, like leading others, then it's a profession. And if you look at professionals, like athletes, they all have coaches." "Our data shows that the pattern of behaviors of exemplary leaders is not generationally specific." "Generalizing about a generation is, in its own way, a form of discrimination." "One word: practice. Or maybe three words: practice, practice, practice." Chapters 00:00 Introduction 02:20 Start of Interview 02:34 How The Leadership Challenge classic came to be 07:24 What has changed about leadership over the years? Or not? 18:02 Leading in a virtual environment 21:38 Diversity and inclusion beyond the numbers 24:04 How to deal with divisiveness 30:06 Leading across generational divides 34:39 What's one thing aspiring leaders should focus on? 37:43 What retirement looks like for Jim 39:39 Interview Wrap Up 40:04 Andy Comments After the Interview 43:10 Outtakes Learn More You can learn more about Jim and his book at LeadershipChallenge.com. If you’d like more on this subject, here are some episodes to check out: Episodes 62, 63,, and 153, with Jim Kouzes Episode 391, with Adam Bryant about his book Leap to Leader AI for Project Managers and Leaders With the constant stream of AI news, it's sometimes hard to grasp how these advancements can benefit us as project managers and leaders in our day-to-day work. That's why I developed our e-learning course: AI Made Simple: A Practical Guide to Using AI in Your Everyday Work. This self-guided course is designed for project managers and leaders aiming to harness AI's potential to enhance your work, streamline your workflow, and boost your productivity. Go to ai.i-leadonline.com to learn more and join us. The feedback from the program has been fantastic. Take this opportunity to unlock the potential of AI for your team and projects. Thank you for joining me for this episode of The People and Projects Podcast! Talent Triangle: Power Skills   The following music was used for this episode: Music: Summer Morning by MusicLFiles License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license Music: Fashion Corporate by Frank Schroter License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license