Cal Newport says we’ve been thinking about productivity all wrong. Cal is an MIT-trained computer scientist and bestselling author specializing in how to work better in our overstimulated world. In this second installment of Say More’s series, BEATING BURNOUT, Shirley talks to Cal about the ways the modern office worker is primed for professional burnout, how hybrid work makes it worse and what we can do about it. He’s not a luddite by any stretch, but he says we should quit social media, and leave our phones behind whenever possible. Cal’s new book is called Slow Productivity: The Lost Art of Accomplishment without Burnout. Email us at [email protected].