Hazel speaks with Trev about racism. She’s known Trev all her life but they’ve never really spoken like this about racism. It is eye opening to sit down with Trev and hear all the personal stories one needs to hear to be convinced or reminded that racism is still a thing. Trev has climbed for 35 years all over the world and has taught climbing for almost his entire working life. We could have talked about anything, but being black in 65 and most likely the first British black climber gives Trev the kind of perspective few have. We talk about: what it’s like growing up in a racist white environment, what it’s like to literally be the only climber that looks like you, living with racism today, lack of racism in the climbing community, the concept of race as a convenient construct, why intentions matter, the ignorance of the white person to racism, the burden/responsibility being a member of a minority, the difference between racism and prejudice, compassion towards the racist, white washing of history/removal of black history, tribalism, class and racism, ‘we’ve had enough’, the current movement, yes there has been progress but it’s no where near good enough. This is a sobering and honest conversation that I hope cuts through all the hashtags and small bites of info we're seeing scattered all over social media. This is only one black voice but in my mind Trev is certainly one to listen to.  He asked to share these resources along side the podcast:  https://www.yesmagazine.org/opinion/2017/09/08/my-white-friend-asked-me-on-facebook-to-explain-white-privilege-i-decided-to-be-honest/?fbclid=IwAR171K6DEfA-nDVaH9Fs-5fydbd3U4k8fpoC5aK9v05xZ4rEw6nSiQTiKJM https://youtu.be/atfVUgyEIOI https://youtu.be/v4amCfVbA_c https://www.google.com/search?q=black+and+british+tv+series&oq=black+and+british&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j46j0l3.16529j1j8&client=tablet-android-samsung-nf-rev1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8