Paul Tough, author, most recently, of "The Years That Matter Most: How College Makes or Breaks Us," speaks to Paul LeBlanc, President of Southern New Hampshire University, about whether Covid will serve as a catalyst to finally force a re-thinking of higher education.  PAUL TOUGH is the author of The Years That Matter Most: How College Makes or Breaks Us and How Children Succeed: Grit, Curiosity, and the Hidden Power of Character. He is a contributing writer to The New York Times Magazine; his writing has also appeared in The New Yorker, The Atlantic, GQ, and Esquire, and on the op-ed page of The New York Times. PAUL LEBLANC has been the president of Southern New Hampshire University since 2003. Formerly, he was the president of Marlboro College from 1996 to 2003. In 2015 he served as Senior Policy Advisor to Under Secretary Ted Mitchell at the U.S. Department of Education, working on competency-based education, new accreditation pathways, and innovation. He is also the chair of the Board of Directors of the American Council on Education. A transcript of this episode is available at Aventine.org Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices