Mónica’s Link Tree with links to preorder her upcoming book ‘I Never Thought Of It That Way’, her website, and more: https://linktr.ee/moniguzman Follow Mónica on Twitter: https://twitter.com/moniguzman Braver Angels website: https://braverangels.org/ References John R. Wood Jr’s previous appearances on Two for Tea: https://soundcloud.com/twoforteapodcast/19-john-wood https://soundcloud.com/twoforteapodcast/58-john-r-wood-jr-and-roderick-graham-black-lives-and-the-george-floyd-protests Buster Benson’s appearance on Two for Tea: https://soundcloud.com/twoforteapodcast/57-buster-benson Timestamps 3:05 Iona reads from Mónica’s upcoming book ‘I Never Thought Of It That Way’, leading to a discussion of the complexities of identity and expressing oneself and the temptation to use membership of certain groups as a shield in arguments. 12:53 Our interpersonal “internal assumption assistant”: positives and negatives. 14:38 Mónica’s lens when writing her book. What angle on polarisation and having better conversations does Mónica’s book have that other such books lack? The problem of “chaining.” “It’s all people.” 20:24 How our attitudes and beliefs arise from our particular experiences across time rather than rational cogitation. Why we must learn to ask where other people are coming from instead of arguing with people’s conclusions directly. 24:41 The process of changing minds: again, experiences and relationships matter most. 30:28 The benefits of listening to and learning from and being interested in other people. Mónica’s idea of “respect.” The importance of being curious and open. Mónica - reframing the way we interact with others. 36:55 The dangers of making assumptions about other people’s views when we interact with them. The dehumanising and destabilising effects of social media on our discourse: do we spend too much time in virtual reality? 42:41 The benefits of being surprised. 44:13 Mónica’s experience as a journalist and how this has informed her worldview. Her love of conversation. 48:48 The kinds of questions that are good to ask people, that they respond well to. The difference between questions that inspire openness vs. clamming up - specifics or the way in which we ask the question/who is asking us? 54:13 Iona’s main problem with Twitter: you don’t just talk to people, you can see, at the same time, what they’re saying *about* you to others. “Chaining” and the failure to be curious. How to be more open: small steps. 59:54 Our attachments to our beliefs and the ‘zealotry of converts’ paradox. The pain of changing our beliefs on big issues. Opinions as “snapshots.” How to loosen those attachments in conversation - and why we should do this. Listening to other people doesn’t mean you endorse their views. 1:05:40 Do our conversational difficulties come from a deep fear of being wrong? [‘Editorial’ note: the gif Iona mentions is from the British comedy Peep Show, not Inglourious Basterds!] How do we overcome this fear? The long, slow process of changing one’s mind - the distant and often unintended consequences of arguments. 1:11:52 Twitter question: are there any guests Mónica would refuse to have on the Braver Angels podcast and if so, on what criteria? 1:22:29 Twitter question: What had to be trimmed from Mónica’s book that she would have liked to have kept in? Is she planning a second book? 1:27:14 Is there anything Mónica wishes Iona had asked her or that Iona didn’t give her a chance to talk about?