In this episode, we are joined by both Jo Ramirez-Messina and Jeff Newman, two leaders of the reform ABA movement. If you are a behavior analyst wondering how to build your ableism lens, this is where it should start. Jeff pushes each of us to think about “what is good ABA” and Jo discusses ABA in the context of trauma. To read about some of the topics presented in the show please see: https://www.facebook.com/Behaviorbabe/posts/abalit-effects-of-a-perseverative-interest-based-tokeneconomy-on-challenging-and/2111988708829463/ https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fpubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov%2F31281959%2F%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR2zRmMDjXVQLjQvcWCOFzGkcWqyBeb3hEO7dILRvP3p4zXJslE_3lupv40&h=AT1sklrpjOMxC_cyr2tm1CvQNiRimgo46QmxIn6Ducmc6CaAC8OvgE50Bn5nmF3LrXGmFLjcymIUArRz9-BzG4cn86lL7e5GTzOF9ziq-awinrUZfowfnRWgwZSG3GU5fS8 https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fdigitalcommons.usu.edu%2Fetd%2F7898%2F%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR2zRmMDjXVQLjQvcWCOFzGkcWqyBeb3hEO7dILRvP3p4zXJslE_3lupv40&h=AT1sklrpjOMxC_cyr2tm1CvQNiRimgo46QmxIn6Ducmc6CaAC8OvgE50Bn5nmF3LrXGmFLjcymIUArRz9-BzG4cn86lL7e5GTzOF9ziq-awinrUZfowfnRWgwZSG3GU5fS8 To learn more about this movement please visit their facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/groups/ABAReform As always, we hope that you enjoy the conversation, as much as we enjoyed recording it. Please follow us on FB @BeautifulHumansCast or IG @BeautifulHumansChange --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/beautiful-humans/support