Today, we are learning from Barbara Holzner. Barbara is CEO of iCONDU GmbH and supports companies, municipalities, and organizations with complex challenges such as sustainability and digitalization. As a consultant, she moderates participation and strategy processes and supports her clients with innovative methods for impact-oriented project development and management. As a trainer and facilitator, she trains skills for dealing with complexity and shaping sustainable transformation. Together with her team, she develops tools such as the systems thinking software simcision and the SDG simulation game Sustain2030. Barbara studied Digital Media at Ulm University of Applied Sciences. During her studies, she gained practical experience in the design and project management of complex applications. In her part-time Master's degree in Educational Media at the University of Duisburg-Essen, she is working on the didactic design of digital learning applications. In addition to the development of simulation games and the design of participation formats, her focus is on the moderation of strategy and decision-making processes. Since the beginning of 2016, she has enriched iCONDU with her enthusiasm for co-creative solutions. Let's get started... In this conversation with Barbara Holzner, I learned: * 00:00 Intro * 00:30 How Barbara and her team use the inner development goals in practice, with the IDG round table. Just 30 minutes, on Friday after lunch. * 08:00 Growing, as a team, together. * 10:00 The effect of working on inner development with the team weekly, inner and outer growth. * 14:00 Complexity as a chance. Use it and don't have a fear of complexity. * 14:45 The complexity of decision making. * 17:30 Using systems thinking and simulations to support decisions. * 23:45 Decision-making and Ai and data. * 26:20 Opening up the black box of Ai for decision-making. * 33:00 What we can do with the SDG simulation game, sustain2030. * 46:00 Thinking about the hours you have left in your career and decide to make a difference and want to have more impact. * 47:30 The decision to move away from the design career and focus on sustainability, complexity, and decision-making. * 53:00 This is simcision and learning about complex systems. * 54:10 All models are wrong, but some are useful - George Box * 1:04:05 The importance of play for learning, and training is for inner development and achieving sustainable transformation. More about Barbara Holzner: * linkedin.com/in/barbara-holzner * http://www.icondu.de  * https://sustain2030.de/  * https://simcision.com Video of the conversation with Barbara Holzner https://youtu.be/juVEtlXV1Sw Watch here https://youtu.be/juVEtlXV1Sw