The Hosts: James and Mauting In this episode,  James and Mauting  are discussing sustainability, environmental law, public participation, and education. Their conversation spans a range of topics, including the creative aspects of interpreting and implementing environmental laws. The discussion also delves into the interconnectedness of various factors in sustainability, such as law, economics, and society, emphasizing the importance of systems thinking. James and Mauting also covers the evolving nature of law, particularly in the context of sustainability, where principles like precautionary measures and transitioning laws are introduced to accommodate the changing era of anthropogenic influence. Mauting talks about the climate litigation, especially efforts to hold businesses and politicians accountable for future emissions and climate change impacts. Then they also explore the challenges of public participation, discussing the need for empowerment and awareness among the general public. Welcome to listen to this episode !