The American prison system is in shambles. Rehabilitation efforts fall short, recidivism rates soar, and the numbers show that our incarceration system fails to actually make us any safer. While the notion of abolishing prisons might sound radical, entertaining its principles could help cast light on the shortcomings of our current system and steer us toward a more just society. This week, Adam sits down with Tommie Shelby, a philosopher and professor of African-American studies at Harvard, who authored The Idea of Prison Abolition. Together, they discuss the historical of prison abolition, its feasibility, and its relationship with the practicalities of prison reform.