As Chief Scientific Advisor to the government during a pandemic, Sir Patrick Vallance's calm, clear summaries of the state of our scientific understanding of the virus were welcomed by many. But what was going on behind the scenes? In this extended interview with Jim Al-Khalili on Radio 4's Day of The Scientist, Sir Patrick opens up and together they explore that trickiest of relationships - the one between scientists and politicians. How do we make sure we get evidence-based policy not policy-based evidence? Scientists tend to gain prominence during a crisis but the need for scientific input to government is ever present. And as head of the new Office for Science and Technology Strategy, based in the Cabinet Office, Sir Patrick hopes to put science and technology at the heart of policy making in government. However, only about 10% of the recent fast stream civil service intake have a scientific degree. That needs to change, says Sir Patrick. What science and technology do we need to invest in to deal with the big science-based challenges ahead, such as achieving carbon net zero, preserving a diversity of species, and protecting our privacy and slowing the spread of misinformation online? What does the UK need to do to capitalise on our scientific expertise and make Britain the science superpower that the Prime Minister hopes it will become? Produced by Anna Buckley. First broadcast on Tuesday 12 October 2021.