Rachel and Simon speak with Perminder Mann, CEO of Bonnier Books UK. She was the first member of her family to go to university, where she studied drama; after declining an unpaid internship in the media, she turned to publishing, working in sales first at Macmillan, then Transworld and Bonnier. She left Bonnier for a stint in the toy industry, but returned to the company several years later. In 2015 and 2016 she was included on the Bookseller's list of the most influential people in publishing. She became CEO of Bonnier Books UK in 2018, and is also chair of the Publisher’s Association Consumer Publishers Council. We spoke to Perminder about her entry into publishing, her work at Bonnier, now the seventh-largest publisher in Britain, and the idea of author as brand. This episode is sponsored by Curtis Brown Creative, the writing school attached to the major literary agency. CBC has provided an exclusive discount for Always Take Notes listeners. You can use the code ATN20 for £20 off the full price of Creative Writing for Beginners, or any other four- or six-week online writing course. You can find us online at alwaystakenotes.com, on Twitter @takenotesalways and on Instagram @alwaystakenotes. Our crowdfunding page is patreon.com/alwaystakenotes. Always Take Notes is presented by Simon Akam and Rachel Lloyd, and produced by Artemis Irvine. Our music is by Jessica Dannheisser and our logo was designed by James Edgar.