As always, check out our Substack for a full list of show notes, ramblings and recommendations This week we delve into the the tricky subject of when you feel like you want to throw in the towel, and give up trying to make ‘ends meet’ as an artist… First, Julie chats about why she’s feeling peppy and shares her enthusiasm over her newest cloudscapes. Phoebe shares how the winter school holidays are going, how she survived a long car journey and her plans for a local kids art workshop. This brings them onto the topic, as Phoebe reveals she’s been finding it challenging running an art business lately. They chat about the pitfalls of being self employed during a time when the economy is struggling, and what other options there are out there for artists. Julie boulsters Phoebe’s moral and reminds her of all the ways she’s diversified her income stream, and they discuss how feeling like ‘quitting’ can really just be a motivator to explore new directions or just to press pause on full time arting, and perhaps supplement your income another way - and how none of these makes you a failure. We have never had so many people DM us about a topic before, so next week we’ll be dedicating a whole episode to answering your listener questions around quitting. If you have any more questions please drop us a line and let us know. Mentioned in this episodePhoebe’s kids podcast suggestion list: Tumble Science Podcast for Kids, Smash Boom Best, Who When Wow!Stereophonic song - One Thousand TreesCreative NZ article Creative New Zealand and NZ On Air creative professionals research releasedGlennon Doyle ‘We can do hard things"‘ episode on quitting Find Julie here: www.juliebattisti.com , @juliebattisti & Julie’s newsletter Find Phoebe here: www.phoebegander.com , @phoebeganderart  & Phoebe’s newsletter: Podcast Website: Submit a question or fail here Buy us a Ko-fi!  Please don’t forget to rate and review! And take a screenshot and tag us in your stories to help spread the word… Keep Failing! Julie & Phoebe xx Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.