TW: suicide, abuse Krispin interviews Dr. Mark G. Karris, therapist and author of The Diabolical Trinity: Healing Religious Trauma from a Wrathful God, Tormenting Hell, and a Sinful Self. They talk about “In the Light” by DC Talk. Mark has written other books, including Religious Refugees: (De)Constructing Toward Spiritual and Emotional Healing and Divine Echoes: Reconciling Prayer With The Uncontrolling Love Of God In the episode Mark mentions Brian Peck and also Kristen Neff’s work in self compassion. Here’s a link to some of her guided mediations that I really like.  We’d love for you to consider joining our patreon community to support this podcast.  You can find us on Twitter and Instagram. Head to our website to find more info and a transcript for this episode.